Interview

Ambassador Grigol Mgaloblishvili:  More projects to come

By Bernard KENNEDY

At 32, Ambassador Grigol Mgaloblishvili of Georgia is one of Ankara’s youngest ambassadors but also one of those who are most familiar with Turkey. He first came to Istanbul as an exchange student and later worked in the capital as an interpreter. Joining the Foreign Ministry in 1995, he visited Ankara several times and took diplomatic courses at the Middle East Technical University. Between 1998 and 2001, he successively held the posts of first secretary and counsellor at the Georgian Embassy here. After further study in Oxford, he rose to become director of the Europe and EU Integration Department at the Ministry in Tbilisi. He was appointed ambassador in 2004, in the wake of momentous events in his home country. Those events, Georgia’s relations with Turkey and its other neighbours and, of course, the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan pipeline project, were among the main themes of our interview.

Q  We are approaching the second anniversary of the Rose Revolution on November 23. In what ways has Georgia changed for the better?

A  There have been so many changes; it’s impossible to list them all. Corruption has gone down significantly. We have simplified tax procedures and cut the number of taxes. Customs is working much more efficiently. In order to tackle the root causes of corruption, the bureaucracy has been downsized but the salaries of public servants have been raised 6-8 times. As a result, state institutions function more efficiently. Police officers are getting salaries of about US$400 a month, which is ten times what they were receiving before. At the same time, we have eliminated checkpoints. With the change of regime, the budget tripled instantly from 1.2bn lari to over 3bn lari. The increase in the budget is in itself a sign of how much of the Georgian economy was in shadow and how much the administration has improved. We are also working on reforms in education, the judiciary, local government…

Q  How has the economy performed?

A  GDP growth was nearly 7% in 2004. We have kept inflation well within single digits even though the budget has tripled - and despite the large cash inflow because of the privatisation process. The most visible change has been the huge infrastructure works which have been taking place all over the country during the past year. No infrastructure work had been done for fifteen years. Today, visitors to Tbilisi say they cannot recognise it any more. In addition to our own resources, the US is to provide almost US$300m for rehabilitating regional infrastructure and promoting private sector development through the Millenium Challenge Corporation. Turkish companies are among those involved in infrastructure works. To give an example, TAV is constructing two new international airports in Tbilisi and Batumi. We also signed an energy barter accord with Turkey just a few months ago.

Q  What about politics?

A  The main test for new democracies or countries going through transitional periods is elections. Since the Presidential elections in early 2004, we have also held general and by-elections in the Parliament. All these elections have been evaluated as fair and transparent by  all international observers, including Organisation for Security and Organisation in Europe and other institutions. Rigged elections have become a thing of the past.

Q  How much have the changes affected the Foreign Ministry?

A  The whole system has changed, and this is reflected in the foreign service too. In general, a relatively younger generation took over the running of the country – people with more credibility and perhaps a better education. In the Foreign Ministry, career diplomats now have more opportunities for promotion.

Q  What does the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan pipeline mean for Georgia?

A  This is an extremely important project not just for Georgia or the participating countries but for the whole of Europe. It has been a great success thanks to the efforts of the participating countries and the oil companies as well as outside support. When I was in Turkey before, I heard a lot of pessimistic statements to the effect that the project was just political and did not make economic sense. But with today’s oil prices you don’t need to be an expert to realise that it has an extremely important economic dimension as well.

Georgia will receive revenues of US$60-70m per year in transit fees, or US$2bn during the lifetime of the project. This is from Azeri oil alone, and we are now also receiving very positive signals from Kazakhstan. Meanwhile, the construction work has also created side-benefits such as employment and business opportunities. Much more importantly, the pipeline means a diversification of energy routes, an improvement in energy security, the development of regional cooperation and a new place on the world map.

Q  This is not the only infrastructure project involving Georgia and Turkey, is it?

A  Many projects which have been discussed for a long time are now starting to be implemented. We believe that we can complete the Baku-Tbilisi-Erzurum gas pipeline by the end of the next year, to deliver Shah Deniz Gas to Erzurum. This too is crucial for energy diversification of supply because now we have only one supplier. Feasibility studies for the Kars-Tbilisi or Kars-Baku railroad are being conducted with funds allocated by the Turkish government. There have been two trilateral ministerial meetings, and there is a big potential for Kazakhstan to join as well. As has been proved in the case of Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan, we think this will be not just a political project but also an economically viable one. We are discussing opening a new border gate and modernising the Sarp border gate. Another very important issue is the joint use of Batumi Airport for neighbouring regions of Turkey. A fibre-optic cable connection is about to start operating.

Q  Are there any improvements in trade between the two countries?

A  We have always had very good political relations with Turkey but security considerations and corruption made it difficult for Turkish companies to enter the Georgian market. Now it takes only 3-4 minutes to cross the border through the new “green corridor”. During the last six months we have had no complaints of delays from transporters crossing Georgia from Turkey. As of the beginning of next year, the prime ministers of the two countries have announced that citizens of the two countries will be able to travel to one another’s territory for 90 days without having to obtain a visa. Next year, the Black Sea road will shorten the journey from Trabzon to Batumi to just one-and-a-half hours. All these things will benefit trade. We are contemplating a bilateral trade volume of US$2bn within three years. There are still a lot of things to be done to liberalise our trade relations. We are working intensively towards a free trade agreement or a preferential trade agreement, and an agreement on the avoidance of double taxation. We hope that we will be able to sign both of these agreements by the end of this year, for the benefit of business people and all our citizens.

Q  What are you selling to Turkey?

A  We are selling goods like fertilisers, chemicals, wood products and iron and steel. But we are especially focusing on agriculture. Most of the agricultural products in Georgia are organic and we believe that they can compete in any market. Among processed agricultural products, wine is a major item. Georgian wine is not just a simple commodity but a part of our national identity. We believe that it will gain its place in the Turkish market, especially if we take into consideration the increase in tourists coming to Turkey from CIS countries - Georgian wine is one of the most popular in this area.

Q  What is the state of cultural relations between Georgia and Turkey?

A  During the Soviet period the doors between the two states were locked for almost 70 years. This was followed by a period of turmoil. By developing our cultural relations we are getting to know each other as neighbouring countries should. There is great potential. We share the same geography and have a common cultural heritage as well. There are a lot of significant Georgian monuments in Turkey and a lot of Ottoman monuments in Georgia. We have recently just started to cooperate to take care of these historical moments. This will help us to publicise our cultural connections not just in Turkey and Georgia but worldwide. We have a rich mutual agenda of festivals and exhibitions in the two countries. We frequently hold exhibitions at our embassy as well. As part of our efforts to introduce Georgia’s rich, unique culture to Turkey we have opened free Georgian language courses within the Embassy and the numbers of people who applied was well beyond our expectations.

Q  Are there any problems in your relations with Turkey?

A  No, we have no political difficulties. Although we are neighbours and it’s not an easy region, Turkey and Georgia have set a good example of how relatively smaller and larger countries can cooperate in a very constructive way.

Q  What about your relations with other neighbouring countries?

A   It’s a part of our foreign policy to have good, constructive relations with all our neighbours without any exception. We are doing our best. We have strategic cooperation and very close relations with Azerbaijan. We have good, constructive, very beneficial partnership with Armenia. We are taking steps to normalise our relations with Russia. Firstly, we now have a clear timetable that by the end of 2008 there will be no Russian military bases in Georgia. This is not just the will of current administration, but the political will of Georgian nation. Secondly, we are aiming to elaborate the expediency of the sole presence of Russian peace-keepers and make the Russian involvement more constructive than it is today, in order to solve frozen conflicts more efficiently. Our Parliament has just adopted a resolution concerning the CIS peace-keeping forces to the effect that if Georgia does not see any progress or if peace-keepers do not function in an effective way our parliament will ask our executive bodies to start negotiations on ending the peace-keeping mission. I am sure that a strong, united prosperous Georgia will benefit Russia much more than a Georgia which has unresolved conflicts on its soil, so we expect the Russia side to be more constructive in the conflict resolution process because both sides will benefit. This is not a new idea. President Saakashvili said in his inaugural speech that we should forget all of those old disputes and start our relations from a new page.

Q  But you also have US forces on your territory…

A  No. We have some training programmes. We had a very successful train-and-equip programme for three years. Now we have started a new phase. US instructors are training our military forces. Both the US and Turkey are assisting Georgia in building up its armed forces. When one neighbouring country assists another neighbouring country in building up its armed forces, it means that there is full trust between the two states. Likewise, if the US is training our forces to NATO standards, this shows that the US wants to see a strong, stable, democratic Georgia, within the Euro-Atlantic structures of security.

Georgia is a small state, but it is contributing significantly to international peace-keeping operations such as Afghanistan, Kosovo and Iraq. International terrorism is a threat to all of us and when any area becomes a breeding ground for international terrorism all parties should be united and tackle this problem. I should add that the same applies to Abkhazia and southern Ossetia too, because they are just criminal enclaves and it’s very easy for them to become centres for smuggling drugs and weapons and other kinds of trafficking and all kind of illegal activity. So these uncontrolled territories are not just an internal problem of Georgia but it has a negative effect on the whole region - and the effects may reach beyond the region. All parties should work together to overcome this problem. Above all, all states and political groups should avoid double standards when they approach such sensitive issues.

Q  Where do you stand on the Karabakh dispute?

A  We are for the stability of the southern Caucasus. We support the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Azerbaijan. This approach is the main pillar of our relations with any other state. At the same time we are for the peaceful resolution of all conflicts.

(DIPLOMAT  -  November 2005  -  Ankara)